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  • #757062
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    brad
    Participant
    Joined: 21 Jul 2010
    Location: France
    Total posts: 222

    Can anyone help….

    I receive a government military pension, and have not – up to now – paid social charges on it. I pay the 8% requirement to the CPAM for health cover.

    However, a friend has said this exemption is not the case and that social charges are due on the pension even though it’s taxed at source in the UK.

    I have always believed that only income taxed in France is liable to social charges, or have I got it all wrong (or have they changed the rules) ??

    Any help/guidance would be much appreciated.


    Brad

    #1023545
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    pomhorn
    Participant
    Joined: 19 Sep 2005
    Location: Eure - ex Deux-Sèvres
    Total posts: 27222

    Hi!

    No CSG if you have an S1 only.

    Yours,

    pomhorn


    pomhorn

    #1023546
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    pomhorn
    Participant
    Joined: 19 Sep 2005
    Location: Eure - ex Deux-Sèvres
    Total posts: 27222

    Hi!

    No CSG if you have an S1 only.
    Also marginal cases of very , very low total income (Then you need to speak to the Tax Office )

    Yours,

    pomhorn


    pomhorn

    #1023544
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    brad
    Participant
    Joined: 21 Jul 2010
    Location: France
    Total posts: 222

    Pomhorn,

    Many thanks for the prompt reply, but I’m still slightly confused.

    I thought the S1 form was for newly arrived ex-pats to cover their healthcare for a pre-determined length of time.

    I have been here 8 years, have a permanent residency card and pay the CPAM the 8% of my income as I mentioned previously.

    I thought the next change to my healthcare cover would be when I received my state pension next year, and stopped paying the CPAM.

    My real question is still “should I be paying social charges on my government pension ??” in my situation.


    Brad

    #1023543
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    smokey15
    Participant
    Joined: 05 Jun 2013
    Location: Brittany
    Total posts: 66

    Under the Double Taxation Treaty your should not pay CSG on your Government Pension. It is specifically mentioned at Paragraph 1(b) (v) (les contributions sociales generalises) as being included in the treaty.


    #1023542
    Redbidet
    Redbidet
    Participant
    Joined: 17 Jul 2003
    Location: EUROPE
    Total posts: 5081

    The double taxation treaty between France and the UK
    http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxtreaties/in-force/france.pdf

    covers this.

    Government pensions are not liable to French social charges.


    #1023540
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    pomhorn
    Participant
    Joined: 19 Sep 2005
    Location: Eure - ex Deux-Sèvres
    Total posts: 27222

    hI!

    See this:

    A ‘government service pension’ is paid to former members of HM Forces, ex Civil Service and Foreign and Commonwealth Office employees, as well as ex local authority employees. National Health service pensions are not considered to be a ‘government service pension’.

    from:

    http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxation/taxation/liability-income-tax/income/

    Yours,

    pomhorn


    pomhorn

    #1023541
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    parsnips
    Participant
    Joined: 18 Aug 2008
    Location: charente - maritime 17
    Total posts: 2424

    Hi,
    Government pensions are exempted from all french taxes , including CSG, by articles 2, 19 and 24 of the international convention on double taxation of 2008. The S1 has nothing to do with this exemption.


    #1023539
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    brad
    Participant
    Joined: 21 Jul 2010
    Location: France
    Total posts: 222

    Smokey15, Redbidet, Parsnips,

    Many thanks for clearing this up for me, I thought I was being less than honest with our local tax office (and, I will sleep a lot better tonight than I did last night !)

    Brad.


    Brad

    #1023538
    Redbidet
    Redbidet
    Participant
    Joined: 17 Jul 2003
    Location: EUROPE
    Total posts: 5081

    @pomhorn wrote:

    hI!

    See this:

    A ‘government service pension’ is paid to former members of HM Forces, ex Civil Service and Foreign and Commonwealth Office employees, as well as ex local authority employees. National Health service pensions are not considered to be a ‘government service pension’.

    from:

    http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxation/taxation/liability-income-tax/income/

    Yours,

    pomhorn

    Not quite correct

    http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/intmanual/INTM343040.htm

    lays down what is and what is not classed as a Government Pension

    National Health Service Pension

    paid by CAPITA or the Paymaster Generals Office is a non govt pension
    paid by a Local Authority is a Govt pension

    Teachers pensions .Police pensions are also Govt pensions.,


    #1023537
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    pomhorn
    Participant
    Joined: 19 Sep 2005
    Location: Eure - ex Deux-Sèvres
    Total posts: 27222

    Hi!

    See also this French text, which is somewhat more adapted (than a double imposition agreement ) to present of the Tax Office in order to claim refund.

    http://www.juritravail.com/Actualite/fiscalite-particulier/Id/63351

    S’agissant particulièrement de nos amis britanniques, la CSG et la CRDS ne s’appliquent pas aux pensions qui, taxables au Royaume Uni, en application de la convention fiscale franco britannique de 2008, ouvrent droit à crédit d’impôt en France. Il s’agit notamment des pensions de gouvernement telles que, par exemple, celles versées par l’Armée ou la Diplomatie.

    Yours,

    pomhorn


    pomhorn

    #1023536
    Avatar
    pomhorn
    Participant
    Joined: 19 Sep 2005
    Location: Eure - ex Deux-Sèvres
    Total posts: 27222

    Hi!

    See also this French text, which is somewhat more adapted (than a double imposition agreement ) to present of the Tax Office in order to claim refund.

    http://www.juritravail.com/Actualite/fiscalite-particulier/Id/63351

    S’agissant particulièrement de nos amis britanniques, la CSG et la CRDS ne s’appliquent pas aux pensions qui, taxables au Royaume Uni, en application de la convention fiscale franco britannique de 2008, ouvrent droit à crédit d’impôt en France. Il s’agit notamment des pensions de gouvernement telles que, par exemple, celles versées par l’Armée ou la Diplomatie.

    Yours,

    pomhorn

    PS. Better results with : swisscows.ch provider.


    pomhorn

French Tax and Law
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