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  • #1814300
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    davidaldis22
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    Joined: 12 Feb 2013
    Location: Causse-et-Diège (12)
    Total posts: 70

    I’m not entirely sure if this is the right place to post, but I’ll give it a go.

    Back in July I bought a heat exchanger heater/cooler from our local Brico.  It was a good deal, and as we already had a 10% discount card, the price was even better.

    French law dictates that a/cs have to be commissioned by an artisan, and the manufacturer was offering the commissioning service for 149€.  The warranty is fully dependant on this.  Brico convinced us that the unit would be installed for that price (I was dubious).  So, we paid on line and said artisan rolled up after driving from about 150 km away.

    Needless to say, he was looking to do a 20 minute commissioning (the a/c is precharged and only needs plugging in the gas pipes and an electrical connection – even I could do it) and not a 3 or 4 hour hole drilling exercise through a 1 metre stone wall.

    Bye, bye artisan.

    So a friend and I carried out the installation right up to the plugging in bit.

    Then came weeks long “discussions” with the maker.  Brico had the same discussions with them, based largely on the complete and utter lack of customer service.

    To cut a long story short, we paid another 149€ in September, and since then – nothing.  No artisan, no contact and more to the point, no heating (it was -4 last night).  The blower is sitting on the wall, completely divorced from the other bit.

    I have tried contacting their mother company in Holland with no joy, so I’m looking for suggestions for the next step.  French friends suggest our local Consumer Advice Bureau.  My builder mate says go to the Huisiers.

    Any ideas, anyone?


    #1814302
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    kathyc
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    Joined: 30 Aug 2005
    Location: Mussidan
    Total posts: 3579

    Personally I’d forget about the warranty and do it myself.


    #1814305
    Aardvark
    Aardvark
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    Joined: 27 May 2009
    Location: 22
    Total posts: 2457

    Personally I’d forget about the warranty and do it myself.

    <hr />

    Sound advice, given the fact that you are likely to have the same aggro if you tried to claim under any French warranty.


    #1814372
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    davidaldis22
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    Joined: 12 Feb 2013
    Location: Causse-et-Diège (12)
    Total posts: 70

    I would agree, but there is the small issue of the 149€ that I have already paid them to commission it.


    #1814387
    vic evans
    vic evans
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    Joined: 25 Apr 2015
    Location: Brittany 29
    Total posts: 4066

    I would agree, but there is the small issue of the 149€ that I have already paid them to commission it.

    <hr />

     

    According to your post you have paid 149€ twice. How much did you pay for this, presumably split unit & what type is it?

    French Law apart there is nothing to commission on a unit like this . If they are gassed up & wired correctly they either work or they don’t. There are no adjustments to be made as everything is controlled by the systems electronics & sensors. If you join up the pre-charged gas lines & they leak you’ll need the services of a fridge expert but that’s about it. The law is probably there to avoid leaks & the discharge of gasses into the atmosphere & that’s about it.

    Years ago I fitted & put to work my first Brico cheapo unit but it’s all singing all dancing replacement costing over four times it’s cost was purchased through a dealer/installer as I was not prepared to accept the risk on this unit.

    My advice is bite the bullet & if you think you can safely join up the lines without losing gas or letting in air & contaminating the system just go for it & then set about getting your money back ‘in the warm’


    The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.

    #1814577
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    davidaldis22
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    Joined: 12 Feb 2013
    Location: Causse-et-Diège (12)
    Total posts: 70

    The unit was 700€, and is a Qlima with wifi.  I wasn’t going to name and shame, but you did ask.

    A few weeks after we bought it and applied on line for the commissioning, we got a call from an artisan in Milau.  This was a Saturday, and he said that he would come the next day (yes, Sunday!) to do his thing.  Unfortunately when we told him that we were 120km from him, he changed his mind.

    A couple of weeks later, we had a call from a Gaillac based artisan (again about 120km from us) who said he would be round the next day.  Another no show, but he did arrive the day after, with the outcome detailed in my original post.

    Then came the long discussions with Qlima France.  We capitulated on the original 149€ and wrote it off as it was our fault for misunderstanding the deal.  Brico has offered a 149€ voucher to make up for this (we have yet to get this) as they sort of contributed to the misunderstanding.

    So, we paid again, and have been trying ever since to get the thing commissioned.

    I should make 3 points.

    We asked the Gaillac artisan for a separate quote to commission.  He quoted 300€.  This means that any work carried out by him on contract to Qlima is carried out at a loss.  Qlima does not have their own commissioners and subs out the work.  It appears that they do not have anyone local to us.

    Our Dutch neighbours bought the same unit in Holland, and were able to get a full warranty even though they installed it themselves here last week.

    We have a qualified a/c qualified friend who is happy to sign off the installation for 50€.  But he is not acceptable to Qlima.  So no warranty.

    I’m open to ideas.


    #1814588
    vic evans
    vic evans
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    Joined: 25 Apr 2015
    Location: Brittany 29
    Total posts: 4066

    We have a qualified a/c qualified friend who is happy to sign off the installation for 50€. But he is not acceptable to Qlima. So no warranty. I’m open to ideas.

    Looking at the Qlima website it seems they are suppliers of equipment rather than manufacturers so I’m not surprised at the lack of interest.

    If I was you I’d accept I’d made a bad decision, bite the bullet & get your mate to connect it up.

    The odds are it’ll be fine so you’ll not have warranty problems & if it’s not it’s no different to sitting on your wall reminding you you should have got a couple of quotes from reputable  local companies who use ‘known brand’ equipment such as Daikin, Mitsubishi,Panasonic etc with full manufacturers support.  Too many folk get burnt buying cheap brico stuff like this but I rather suspect you now know that.

    At the moment you have a grands worth of nothing & a cold house so what’s to lose?


    The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.

    #1814602
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    Chanceux
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    Joined: 17 Mar 2010
    Location: Picardie
    Total posts: 13130

    French law dictates that a/cs have to be commissioned by an artisan, and the manufacturer was offering the commissioning service for 149€.  The warranty is fully dependant on this.

    The first statement is not true but it does not surprise me that the manufacturer would use terms that would suggest it, the second part re warranty is common.

    As you have discovered there is a financial arrangement between the contracted service engineers and the company, it is my belief and I get the impression that you are coming around to it that if you were ever able to get them to honour a warranty problem, an engineer travelling 120km from his base unpaid by the company is going to find some reason to make it a chargeable call including his travel time, in short you are paying €149 for the pleasure of being reamed during the warranty period if it needs attention.

    You say its not working so I guess you have not connected the lines, are they the supposedly pre-charged lines with no loss connectors? (I say supposedly because most are not) if they are not then your local frigorist is going to have to pull a vacuum and fill the system with refrigerant which will cost more like the €149 than the €50 for a commissioning certificate.

    Even if it has the connectors and is working its likely to be below the threshold pressure requiring him to do the same and many of these frigorists work in the same way, €149 is better than €50.

    If it does not have the no loss couplings and pre-charged lines then you will have to get it charged, I would find someone local with a good reputation to do it rather than someone tied to the manufacturer who both serve their own interests especially if they are 120 bornes away.

    If it has the pre-charged lines then I agree with Vic, its cold and you have nothing to lose (assuming that you decide to forget the dubious manufacturers warranty) if it works great, you might consider getting the local frigoriste to check the pressure and refrigerant quantity.

    I would then try and get the €149 back from the manufacturer citing their failure to perform, good luck with that!

    I just consider everything that I buy to have no guarantee, most stuff never needs it, that which does I can usually fix in 10 minutes myself.


    #1814606
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    Chanceux
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    Joined: 17 Mar 2010
    Location: Picardie
    Total posts: 13130

    Just to add that my clime is the last of the old school ones with the planet killing refrigerant gas, that came overcharged with a procedure for bleeding off the air in the lines which was outlawed because consumers were getting frostbite and venting ozone depleting gasses to the atmosphere.

    I did the procedure and the unit worked but was there enough refrigerant gas left within, was there air in there, how long would it last etc?

    Same deal, I could pay Airton to send someone to verify it and then I would have a warranty which I value at zero, I took a chance, the unit only cost around €100, the ise en service would cost more, apart from the programming needing a reboot infrequently the unit is still heating and cooling comme il faut over a decade later.


    #1814619
    vic evans
    vic evans
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    Joined: 25 Apr 2015
    Location: Brittany 29
    Total posts: 4066

    , apart from the programming needing a reboot infrequently the unit is still heating and cooling comme il faut over a decade later.

    Really?

    That’s interesting because it’s on record here that you’ve said it’s constantly icing up. I well remember pointing you to the relevant Airton web page which explains the fault when you asked for advice.


    The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.

    #1814647
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    davidaldis22
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    Joined: 12 Feb 2013
    Location: Causse-et-Diège (12)
    Total posts: 70

    All,

    I bit the bullet and wired it up myself.

    Nice warm air is now pouring out.

    Thanks to all who proffered advice.  That’s what forums are for!

    David


    #1814654
    vic evans
    vic evans
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    Joined: 25 Apr 2015
    Location: Brittany 29
    Total posts: 4066

    All, I bit the bullet and wired it up myself. Nice warm air is now pouring out. Thanks to all who proffered advice. That’s what forums are for! David

    <hr />

    Good Man , Good result :good:


    The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.

    #1814667
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    kathyc
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    Joined: 30 Aug 2005
    Location: Mussidan
    Total posts: 3579

    Well done and think how nice the cool air in the summer will be as well!

    Keep us updated on how you get on with the refund as well.


    #1814668
    vic evans
    vic evans
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    Joined: 25 Apr 2015
    Location: Brittany 29
    Total posts: 4066

    Well done and think how nice the cool air in the summer will be as well!

    Living at Earths End with an East-West orientated house it’s rare that cooling is required but when it is……boy is it welcome & am I  glad I elected for a reverse cycle heat pump :yahoo:


    The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.

French Electrical & Other Building Issues
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